Re: Unable to delete orphaned 1.5 GB System Restore folder



Glad to hear you got the problem fixed.

The fact that the tech support is based in India has nothing to do with the
quality of the support. I have had excellent tech support from overseas
calls and very poor support from North American calls. If you have ever have
to use HP support you'll see what I mean. The level of support is set by the
company not the contracted support center.

--
Kerry
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User

puzzled and frustrated wrote:
Yes, you are right. The only computers i fix are my own. I'm a
software developer, and not for Windoze. And yes, I tried making a
BartPE boot last year to tackle this problem but something was not
right with it so i threw it away. I'll do that again and get it to
work properly.

But i was able to delete that folder and all subfolders and files by
taking ownership and full control, with inherited properties to all
1500 files in subfolders.

My hard drive now has 0.8 MB (compressed space) more room. And yes,
when you stop learning you're dead. I'm sure you all who are
knowledgeable about NT get very frustrated when you have to pretend
that you're doing the troubleshooting the person in India is reading
off a computer screen and aking you do things you did twice before
even calling ... and you know it's a waste of time but they make you
do it before bumping you up to someone who actually knows something.

You have quite a good crowd here. Sorry for being so snappy and
inconsiderate. My DSL was out for two days before ELNK would finally
pass on a trouble ticket to Covad, who then fixed the problem in a
few hours.

"Kerry Brown" wrote:

By any chance is your computer in a domain and you are using roaming
profiles? If so you may want to leave this folder alone. If not the
solution has already been mentioned at least twice in this thread.

http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/

Most techs that have been around for more than a year or so have a
Windows PE based boot disk for working on NT based machines. BartPE
is probably the most common. I am suprised someone that has been
using computers to make a living for as long as you claim to doesn't
know this. Maybe it's because you don't repair computers for a
living :-)

--
Kerry
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User

puzzled and frustrated wrote:
I'll see if Microsoft can come up with a solution. It'd be worth
the $35 if they can. BTW, when i said i had full control over the
C: drive, it includes all subdirectories with inherited
permissions. It doesn't help to to try doing this in Safe Mode.

It seems clear that neither of you know the mechanism by which
System Restore protects its restore files from deletion by
anything other than Windoze XP Pro with the Disk
Cleanup/Advanced/Save Only Most Recent Restore Point. There seems
to be running process that starts up when i try to delete it or
change ithe attributes of the S-1-5-8 top-level folder and pass it
down to all children folders because i can set those permissions to
All, but in a second or two, Windows always resets it to Read-Only,
so Windoze is starting up a process just to reset the ownership and
privileges of that S-1-5-8 and it undoes any settings i've changed
to take ownership and give myself full rights to the folder and all
subdirectories.

Sorry for being snappy, but i've been using computers to make a
living before most of the people here were even born. Any time i
need tech support, be it with my internet connection, the box, or
any software, all i get for the first hour or two is people in
India following a flow-chart and making me do exactly everything
that i've already tried twice before even calling them. You two
are the same.

I'll call M$FT tomorrow and see if they can come up with a solution
for $35 (or maybe even free since i've never called them for support
with XP and they say the first two incidents are free).

It's clear that neither of you know how System Restore protects its
files. If anyone else has this same problem, i will post the
solution if M$FT can fix the problem.

Thanks for trying, but you have not helped solve the problem. I'm
sure you mean well, and most of the people who post here don't know
as much about this stuff as you do. I was hoping to find someone
who knew how System Restore protects its files.

The one thing i haven't tried yet is to make a full backup, delete
all but most recent restore point, and then turn off System Restore
completely and reboot a few times into Safe Mode and see if i can
delete it then from Safe Mode.

David

"Steven L Umbach" wrote:

Hi Malke.

Thanks for that info. That is pretty much what I thought. I tried
Knoppix a couple times with a utility that was supposed to allow
write and delete and did not work too well. Since I discovered
Bart's PE that is what I use now. Hopefully he will figure it out.
I really don't think it is that complicated of an issue. ---
Steve


"Malke" <notreally@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:%23iqE%23PNfGHA.4828@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Steven L Umbach wrote:


"puzzled and frustrated"
<puzzledandfrustrated@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:83835395-D937-4B33-88CA-EA43EDB1DEDE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
That advice was no help at all. I have FULL CONTROL over the
entire C: drive
and all subdirectories, imcluding C:/TEMP.

You did not give any info on if you checked file permissions or
not. That would be a suspected reason. By the way just becaue you
have full control at the root folder does not mean that you have
full control on all folders/files on the drive. Folders/files can
have explicitly defined permissions instead of inherited
permissions with the system volune information folder being a
perfect example of one and by default only system has permissions
to that folder. If there is one file in a folder that you do not
have fullcontrol/modify permission then you can not delete the
folder.

I don't need instruction in basic Windoze file ownership and
permissions. I
am the OWNER of that file and have full permissions according to
Windows
Explorer. Using the attrib command does more than you suggested
because it
allows the System bit to be taken off of a file or folder. Even
that doesn't
help.

File attributes have absolutely nothing to do with the ability to
delete a file - you are wasting your time dealing with them. If
you have effective delete permissions for a file and the file is
not being used by a process and the file is not corrupt nor is
using an illegal name or a few other obscure reasons you should
be able to delete it.

XP Pro treats the System Restore files with some type of special
protection
similar to the way they prevent you from deleting crucial system
files. Instead of general advice on how to delete files and
change ownership and permissions, i need information specific
to how XP "protects" the System Restore files and how to turn
that off for files no longer used by System Restore.

See if you can delete any files and or child folders. It could be
just a couple files causing the problem. From the parent folder
try going into the security properties/advanced and then select
"replace permisions entries on all child objects". You could also
try deleting from the command line using system by using the AT
command to schedule the delete command in the future by a couple
minutes. Or use the AT command to open the command window to try
using delete which also be running as system which can be
verified by Task manager. Tasks scheduled by the AT command run
as system.

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;313565
--- using the AT command

Does anyone know how to override that "protection"? Gimme a
break. You're
telling me to run CHKDSK when i said the orphaned file is over a
year old and
i've posted that two different versions of Linux won't let me
delete those
files and their folders. It says "ACCESS DENIED."

One single corrupt file could cause the failure where the
operating system can not interpret the security descriptors.
Running Check Disk with the option to automatically fix file
system errors often can fix such a problem. Offhand I don't know
why linux did not work but for any operating system you need
permissions to delete files and root/administrator may not
always have such. I like using Bart's PE better in such
situations and it also allows me to edit the registry of another
Windows operating system when I need to. The link below from
Microsft may be helpful in dealing with files you can not
delete. --- Steve

Steve - If the OP wasn't using an unsupported tool such as Captive
on Linux , then it is completely unsurprising that he couldn't
delete the files from within Linux. All those live cd's such as
Knoppix mount the drives read-only which is A Good Thing. It is
not recommended to try and write to - or delete from - a
partition/drive formatted NTFS. Since the OP has extensively
mentioned permissions, I think we can rule out FAT32. So the OP
isn't quite as computer-savvy as he thinks he is.

As you say, there is probably a permissions issue and a Bart's PE
or even ERD Commander (if the OP is rich) should take care of the
problem.

Of course, the quick and dirty solution would be to back up the
data and clean-install Windows. Since the OP yells at people who
are trying to help him when they make a suggestion that he might
not be as knowledgeable as he thinks he is, I won't bother to
include my usual links to clean-install instructions.

Malke
--
MS-MVP Windows User/Shell
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic"


.



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