Re: Netscreen ScreenOS

From: Leythos (void_at_nowhere.lan)
Date: 10/06/05 

Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2005 10:11:25 GMT

In article <3K11f.2968$R4.454159@news20.bellglobal.com>,
triffid@nebula.net says...
>
>
> Leythos wrote:
>
> > In article <rm01f.7753$2F2.776078@news20.bellglobal.com>,
> > triffid@nebula.net says...
> >
> >>However, if the vendor is no longer willing to sell support, presumably
> >>they do not expect the product to generate further revenue and have
> >>ceased developing firmware updates - so why not make the last version
> >>freely available?
> >
> >
> > Nope, should not be free. That would kind of make the point for paying
> > for updates and other software mute. Windows 2000 is still a good OS,
> > and Office 2000 is still viable, etc....
>
> Yeah, my employer pays big bucks for NT4 security patches - and will do
> so until it's cheaper to retire or redevelop the application. Some
> vendors support obsolete product indefinitely if the customer is willing
> to pay.
>
> > I run a firewall that is 5 years old, not supported, and has not had
> > updates in 2 years, but it's still very strong, has no leaks, and cost
> > me plenty, I would never consider GIVING the firmware away to anyone.
>
> Nor would I consider giving away NT4 patches.
>
> How would you respond if your vendor had developed a firmware update
> with functionality and/or fixes you needed, but refused to sell it to you?

Well, if it took me years to determine that I needed it, after what
would be considered a normal support period, I would be upset, but I
would also understand and have already resigned myself to the fact that
I'm running unsupported/obsolete hardware that is not longer available -
and that it's time to purchase new software/hardware that is fully
supported.

I've had this happen with other firewall products - purchase one, have
NO problems - new technology comes out years later, find that the old
firewall has issues with the new method, no updates since the product is
too old, but the newer products have updates (if you have a
subscription) to resolve it.... Does that mean I'm entitled to purchase
a new firewall on ebay from someone that is selling it for $50 and then
beg people on the Net for a free firmware update and key? Nope.

> >>>So, he may not have any other option.
> >>
> >>Indeed. Should using software you can no longer obtain a license for be
> >>considered piracy?
> >
> >
> > You could consider all software obsolete the day it hits the store, as
> > they are already working on the next release, so why not just pirate
> > everything - in case you miss the sarcasm, taking older
> > software/firmware not freely released to PD is still piracy.
>
> I have a problem with vendors who think they can force me to buy new
> hardware by refusing to sell available firmware updates for existing
> hardware. Blackmail vs piracy?

So, you are advocating that theft is justifiable when it suites your
needs? Have you ever been told - two wrongs don't make a right?

Consider the firewall vendors - they provide free updates for XX months,
some less, some more, after that you have to pay for them. They pay
their developers for making the updates, they pay their sales people to
keep selling, they pay for security audits, etc... So, along comes some
chap that doesn't want to pay for a support contract and is no longer
entitled to free updates - the chap gets a Friend or some lamer on the
net to provide him with the firmware update - money lost to the company,
and if the firmware has problems he's going to expect that they fix that
too..... 

-- 
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