Re: Wrt54G is a FW appliance?

From: Leythos (void_at_nowhere.lan)
Date: 07/31/05 

Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:31:58 GMT

On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:41:57 +0100, Greg Hennessy wrote:

>>Maybe daft is believing that you don't need third-party validation of
>>something that protects your home/business/corporation.
>
> Will this '3rd party' indemnify me and/or my customers if their testing
> and/or methodology is found wanting.
>
> Who will my customers blame, if I install any product purely on the basis
> of some 'third party validation' (to which I had no input) which was found
> wanting in either performance or fitness for purpose ?
>
>
>>[snipped list of features]
>>
>> When it's been tested by a certifying agency and passes, then it's a
>>firewall,
>
> No it damn well isn't. Read the small print.
>
>> until that time we/you can hope that it's a firewall.
>
> ROTFL! When was the last time you did a penetration test.

Let me explain this one more time, read it slowly:

Just because someone comes out with new firmware for a NAT Router, that
does not make it a firewall no matter how many "features" the say they
have added - at the same time, it does not mean it's not a firewall. The
problem is that unless it's been tested and inspected by some reputable
company/organization, there just isn't any way to have a basis for its
acceptance as a firewall. Notice I said tested and reputable in the same
sentence.

As for secure networks and testing, I design secure networks for a living,
and I've been at it for a long time - we've never had a single compromised
customer in our history and I've never had a compromised network as long
as I've been around. I don't install unproven technology, don't believe in
marketing hype, don't believe certification proves that something is
perfect, but, I will start with certified products as a basis for
consideration over non-certified products, then test them in our shop,
test then in the field, and if they pass all of our tests, then I will
test them with select customers and then finally will start using them in
customer solutions on a regular basis.

Now, before you get your dander up, I have nothing against the new
firmware or the NAT routers used in Home solutions, in fact, for home
users I always recommend a NAT solution as the first barrier device in
their protection. At the same time, I don't believe something is a
firewall just because I've read it on Usenet/Web/Print, and I almost never
believe marketing speak, and I trust my ability to test and confirm a
secure solution.

You seem to be asking me, and all of us, to believe that something is a
quality firewall without any certification - and I don't know many people
that are willing to risk their business reputations on unproven solutions
without independent confirmation. 

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