Re: Webservers

From: f00bar@rogers.com
Date: 05/17/02


Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 15:28:26 -0400
From: f00bar@rogers.com
To: Robert Buel <rbuel@solubility.com>

On Wed, May 15, 2002 at 11:46:41AM -0500, Robert Buel wrote:
> That would be true if both NOS's required equal intuition to
> master...but they don't...I can stumble around in MS and see

And there's the problem. This is a security list. We're here
to learn not to just stumble around.

> configurational windows--and usually find what I'm looking for...but on
> a 'NIX box, you have to specifically enter in commands (read: know the
> commands)

read: learn enough to know what you're doing.

> to configure each aspect of the NOS. Sure, there are windowed
> GUI interfaces available, but then, it becomes Windows, doesn't it?

Then you don't know enough about operating systems. Would say that
adding a GUI to DOS made it Mac? After all, Mac popularized the GUI
and predated what you are championing. But remember that the original
poster didn't ask for an alternative to windows, but an alternative to
iis *on* windows. He can keep the GUI and have Apache too.

But if he wants to leave windows and still have a GUI, he can get Mac
OS X, get a UNIX core with the stability and security that goes with
it, Apache (after all, the question was about web servers), and a GUI
that's an integral part of the system, but doesn't crash and take the
whole system down with it. In other words, not wanting to wean off a
GUI is no excuse to not move off Windows. You may be surprised how
much software you use regularly originated on Mac.

And don't even think of arguing that the "Windows" GUI is more intuitive.
It's not intuitive to anyone who used Mac OS or KDE or any other GUI
first. It's not intuitive if it's only intuitive to people who already
know how to use it.

> I agree that once you have mastered the NOS's, that the effort to
> achieve that is, in fact, equal. It's just that the newbie would find it
> easier to have a visual representation and configurational groups to
> learn from--i.e. "figuring it out" is easier.

Once again, recalling that this is a security list, do you really want
a newbie configuring your web server? Seems like just last summer we
had a memorable incident with insufficiently experienced web admins
leaving sites vulnerable. Sure, they should have patched. But which
dialog box in which GUI does a newbie click on to learn that he should
patch? I haven't stumbled on to it yet.

>
> I think that better analogies might be:
> >Driving with an automatic versus a stick shift.
> >Using a manual camera versus an automatic camera
>
> Anyway, we'll just have to agree to disagree!

Better to educate the newbies here on security-basics to not just stumble
around than to merely agree to disagree. GUI or CLI, if you don't know
what you're doing, DON'T DO IT!



Relevant Pages

  • Re: Splash Screens , how could something so basic still be hard?
    ... You say that there "is no message pump to allow for further GUI ... Note that by "there is no message pump", I mean that because of the way the code is written, no message pump is working while the "splash screen" is displayed. ... In a normal Forms app, there would be a message pump loop, and there's no reason to believe that in those examples, one doesn't exist. ... The same technique is possible in Windows, ...
    (microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp)
  • Re: Wiseman and McGhie are Ranting Again
    ... >>>rest of the system by dropping Word's run time priority in stages. ... Nearly everything with a GUI has something like an event ... That part of the OS is the windows manager and is typically a ... That is your event loop. ...
    (microsoft.public.mac.office.word)
  • Re: MFC & Guis
    ... The fact that so many GUI wheels are reinvented by so many devs is an ... Users of Windows software form expectations ... > to learn to use your app. ... > while the client areas exhibit behaviour specific to the application domain. ...
    (microsoft.public.vc.mfc)
  • Re: How to make Forth interesting?
    ... trying to deny that I wrote and distributed lots of software ... I think GUI is a good example. ... Humm, Windows Forth ... to the flash files etc. to create flash images for the target ...
    (comp.lang.forth)
  • Re: Linux, X, ld, gcc, linking, shared libraries and stuff
    ... going beyond solely the application side of things to the GUI / OS ... messages" then Windows could not just not deliver any mouse messages to the ... know what best "treatment" or "prescription" to give someone to get healthy ... adverts "imply heavily" that if you chew their chewing gum, ...
    (alt.lang.asm)