RE: [Dailydave] RE: Network Exploitation Tools akaExploitationEngines & FUD

From: Chuck Fullerton (chuckf69_at_ceinetworks.com)
Date: 09/10/04

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    To: "Dave Aitel" <dave@immunitysec.com>, "Matt Hargett" <matt@use.net>
    Date: Fri, 10 Sep 2004 08:58:22 -0400
    
    

    Dave,

    I must respectfully disagree with something you've said.

    I believe the reason why most business executives don't take Security
    seriously is because of security professionals using FUD or Fear,
    Uncertainty, and Doubt.

    If we act like Used Car Salesmen we should expect to be treated like Used
    Car Salesmen.
    The decision to use Information Security must be a Business decision, not an
    emotional one.

    Sincerely,

    Chuck Fullerton
    CEH,OPST,CISSP,CSS1,CCNP,CCDA,CNA,A+

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Dave Aitel [mailto:dave@immunitysec.com]
    Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 1:58 PM
    To: Matt Hargett
    Cc: Clement Dupuis; 'Clarke, Tyronne (Contractor)';
    focus-ms@securityfocus.com; pen-test@securityfocus.com;
    dailydave@lists.immunitysec.com
    Subject: Re: [Dailydave] RE: Network Exploitation Tools
    akaExploitationEngines

    On Sun, 2004-09-05 at 06:24, Matt Hargett wrote:
    > Clement Dupuis wrote:
    > > Ask both vendors for a demo. See for yourself, try it yourself, that's
    > > probably the best way to find out which one better fill your needs.
    >
    > This is what I always tell prospects who ask me about BugScan versus
    > some other solution. They seem to appreciate the lack of negativity and
    > dick-waving from our side, so far. (Though they apparantly can't say the
    > same for some of the other players in the market.)
    >
    > Does Immunity and CORE play that nicely? Or does one spread FUD about
    > the other?
    >

    I'm constantly spreading FUD. Like, the other day, someone called me up
    and I said, "Hey, the Impact 'Tip of the Day' in version 4.0 has nothing
    on our Exploit Fortunes (tm). With 'Tip of the Day' you'll get useful
    hints on how to adjust their GUI to look exactly how you want it. With
    Exploit Fortunes (tm) you'll get the latest Immunity in-jokes and
    humorous comments, but only if you manage to successfully exploit a
    host. So you have to be truly elite to even see them.

    Honestly, though, it'd be hard for me to spread FUD, cause the last time
    I saw their product was at G-Con when Gera did a short demo, so
    everything I know about it is here-say or based off marketing material
    on their web page.

    Who are some of the other players in the BugScan market? @stake SRA?

    > On a side note, some of the XP/Python weenies say that test-driven
    > development and a suite of unit tests can enforce types, getting the
    > best of both worlds. Anyone have an opinion on this?

    Sounds nutty - cause the great thing about Python is that you don't care
    what Type you're using. A duck is something that quacks, and going
    beyond that is putting on handcuffs when you don't have to. This general
    concept is why Python is so much faster to use than .Net. I mean, it
    goes beyond that, into a language that makes broad generalization
    doable, rather than a huge nightmare the way C++ does. :>

    -dave

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    guaranteed to be 12 students or less to facilitate one-on-one interaction
    with one of our expert instructors. Check out our Advanced Hacking course,
    learn to write exploits and attack security infrastructure. Attend a course
    taught by an expert instructor with years of in-the-field pen testing
    experience in our state of the art hacking lab. Master the skills of an
    Ethical Hacker to better assess the security of your organization.
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