RE: [Full-disclosure] Zotob Worm Remover

From: Todd Towles (toddtowles_at_brookshires.com)
Date: 08/22/05

  • Next message: Mandriva Security Team: "[Full-disclosure] MDKSA-2005:145 - Updated openvpn packages fix several vulnerabilities" 
    Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 16:44:43 -0500
To: "James Tucker" <jftucker@gmail.com>

    James, I agree with you.

    It was n3td3v that stated the following - "The wireless devices were
    most likely the primary source of the spread. Media outlets are
    reporting wireless devices were only an accessory to the spread of the
    worm."

    I agree with Jan, that host based IPS could have stopped this. Cisco's
    CSA is a good example of this type of technology. Host based IPS system
    are commonly seen as anti-rootkit solutions, which is also a very very
    good thing to have. But patch management should not be overlooked just
    because you have a host IPS. The host IPS will give you time to patch,
    but patch management is the last line of defense for vulns. I never said
    it should be the first or only line of defense.

    I am very firm believer in the defense in depth methodology.

    -Todd

    > -----Original Message-----
    > From: James Tucker [mailto:jftucker@gmail.com]
    > Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 4:08 PM
    > To: Todd Towles
    > Cc: Ron DuFresne; full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
    > Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] Zotob Worm Remover
    >
    > It seems to me that the attack was less than a week old from
    > the start date. Default settings on a relatively unchanged
    > box would provide a suitable window of opportunity given the
    > availability of the worm to the deployer. This is more
    > important than network connectivity, which is not of security
    > concern as this is not the exploited layer. Disconnecting
    > networks is what you suggest when you're in trouble, not when
    > you're trying to maintain the daily balance of cost vs
    > function. Moreover, wireless is recieving the blame - however
    > this will only continue whilst your laptop is the device you
    > are using. Eventually will you blame the mobile phone
    > companies for allowing "dangerous traffic" to flow through
    > the repeaters? What about sattelite links - should we filter
    > those and knock the latency up another notch? No, it's the
    > software, once again.
    > Connectivity increases exposure, it doesn't decrease security
    > - the two are not one and the same. 1000 laptops in a city
    > centre network becoming infected less than a week from update
    > release would be unsuprising
    > (read: defaults are once a week at 3). The security of these
    > laptops was not compromised by the wireless presence, it was
    > a medium of travel only. Now lets say, we go back in time and
    > remove all of the wireless NIC's. Now, there are only 750
    > laptops cause we can't generate as much revenue (joke), and
    > of these they're all still connected, just with a different
    > medium. The medium is (specification)centralised and routable
    > in the same manner (ah, so the medium can have 'implications'
    > ;) - the infection rate is the same. Why? because they are
    > all connected. It's BEING CONNECTED not BEING WIRELESS that's
    > the issue here. Yes you may argue, pointlessly however, that
    > wireless has increased average connectivity, however once
    > again, this is only a medium. It's business/personal drive
    > that requires connectedness, not the technology itself.
    >
    > Todd Towles wrote:
    > > This is correct for the first day, maybe two. Then
    > unpatched laptops
    > > leave the corporate network, hit the internet outside the
    > firewall and
    > > then bring the worm back right to the heart of the network the very
    > > next day, bypassing the firewall all together. Firewall is just one
    > > step..it isn't a solve all. Patching would be the only way to stop
    > > this threat in all vectors. That was my point.
    > >
    > > If you aren't blocking 445 on the border of your network, you have
    > > must worse problems with Zotob.
    > >
    > >
    > >>-----Original Message-----
    > >>From: Ron DuFresne [mailto:dufresne@winternet.com]
    > >>Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:15 PM
    > >>To: Todd Towles
    > >>Cc: n3td3v; full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
    > >>Subject: RE: [Full-disclosure] Zotob Worm Remover
    > >>
    > >>On Mon, 22 Aug 2005, Todd Towles wrote:
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>Wireless really isn't a issue. You can get a worm from a
    > >>
    > >>cat 5 as easy
    > >>
    > >>>as you can from wireless. The problem was they weren't
    > patched. Why
    > >>>weren't they patched? Perhaps Change policy slowed them
    > >>
    > >>down, perhaps
    > >>
    > >>>it was the fear of broken programs..perhaps it was the QA
    > group..it
    > >>>doesn't really matter. They go the worm because they were
    > >>
    > >>not patched.
    > >>
    > >>And because they didn't properly filter port 445 is my
    > understanding.
    > >>Unpatched systems behind FW's that fliter 445 were untouched.
    > >>
    > >>Thanks,
    > >>
    > >>Ron DuFresne
    > >>--
    > >>"Sometimes you get the blues because your baby leaves you.
    > >>Sometimes you get'em 'cause she comes back." --B.B. King
    > >> ***testing, only testing, and damn good at it too!***
    > >>
    > >>OK, so you're a Ph.D. Just don't touch anything.
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >
    > > _______________________________________________
    > > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
    > > Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
    > > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
    > >
    >
    _______________________________________________
    Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
    Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
    Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

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